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The following page was printed from RemoteCentral.com:
| Topic: | Antenna in the attic? This thread has 34 replies. Displaying posts 16 through 30. |
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| Post 16 made on Monday January 12, 2004 at 20:04 |
G50AE Active Member |
Joined:
Posts: | March 2003
747 |
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On 01/05/04 15:32, RTI Installer said...
Regarding Bornn
Gilman I like my research better, because I have
personally tested it and know when it will or
will not work. Yeah I have previously stated that when doing an apartment instalation of a satelite system, I have no use for "flat (sic) coax", diplexers, or Ernie Bornn-Gilman. I guess I should revise that statement to include the practice of attic mounting an antenna.
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| Post 17 made on Friday January 16, 2004 at 03:42 |
Sxrxrnr Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | December 2003
100 |
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My local cable company(comcast) now offers local stations(network cbs, nbc, pbs, abc, Fox is coming soon) in HiDef. I am a satellite subscriber(Directv)so have some channels in HiDef, but not network channels. So I used my attic antenna for local HD. I just installed(I already had basic cable)Comcast's HD receiver at 5 bucks per month. So really do not need attic antenna anymore. It was somewhat flaky even though it was a large Channel Master Bow(4228) with a remote controlled rotator. I was in a horrible area, 45 miles away, behind a hill and in the attic. All is well now. An antenna and a rotator will cost you a couple hundred bucks which is 40 months of rental on the HD box. In fact any HD box for sat or off the air will cost you a few hundred dollars so if you are a cable user, this might be the way to go.
I did have a problem putting the DCT 6000(HD Comcast/Motorola box) on my Mx 500 as I was trying to use in a Device Button position other then what was originally the cable box position(position 10--I was using this spot for my Sony Sat HD box). Moved things around and all is well now. Had several posts on this and still do not know why could not use other device positions for this device.
Roger
Calif
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| Post 18 made on Friday January 16, 2004 at 13:03 |
RTI Installer Super Member |
Joined:
Posts: | March 2002
3,320 |
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Attic Antennas can be a pain sometimes, thats to bad. Cable HD is only a shadow of local HD and will never be as good a picture, but ya gota do what ya gota do.
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Never Ignore the Obvious -- H. David Gray |
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| Post 19 made on Friday March 12, 2004 at 20:12 |
RTI Installer: Have you ever tried stacking two CM4228s and pointing them in the same direction? (rather than in a "V" as discussed above)? Would this increase the gain of a digital UHF signal significantly? I'm 50 miles from the transmitter and the CM7775 preamp I tried with my single CM4228 in the attic did not help. The antenna is correctly aimed at the transmitter per the signal meter in my STB. If you think stacking might help, would the procedure to connect the two antennas be the same as you gave above? Thanks. Ok, First go to this address [Link: antennaweb.org]
and locate all the available broadcast towers
that carry the channels you are interested in
Locate an area in your attic farthest away from
any metal obstructions; further if there is another
house near your house, or a big fat tree, that
might block the signal, try to find a spot in
your attic that gives you a work around. I have
found it beneficial to drag a TV and the HD Box
up to the attic, plug in one of the antennas and
just move it around to see what I can get before
I install the whole mess. If you can get some
channels doing this, even if they are kind of
intermittent, you’re in good shape.
If you have the room in your attic. Install an
8-foot pole and mount the antennas one above the
other. Make sure the pole is as perfectly level
as you can get it, mount both of your antennas
facing the general direction indicated by antenna
web. Usually the two antennas will be pointing
in a split V kind of arrangement. If you can get
4228’s in to your attic (they do come apart a
bit) use them as they are a lot more powerful
than the 4221’s.
If you are not experienced with home AC wiring,
hire someone to run a ground for you, If are experienced,
you can usually find a junction box or the back
side of a can light or something that has a ground
in it. If the ground is a #12, run a #12 bare
or green to the first screen reflector and bond
to the crossbar with a ground clamp, and then
jump from that one to the next antenna. Do not
use any coax splitters. Use only 1 X 300 to 75
ohm adapter. Use number 12 copper wire and make
jumps between the wing nut posts on each antenna,
meaning, each antenna has a pair of wing nut posts
on them. This is where you attach the 75 to 300
ohm adapters, but in this case, you use only the
1 adapter on only the first antenna. To attach
the second antenna, run your #12 wire from the
first wing nut on antenna #1 to the first wing
nut on antenna #2. Then run a jump wire from wing
nut #2 on antenna #1 to the 2nd wing nut on antenna
#2. Do not let the jump wires touch any part of
the antennas except for the wing nut terminals?
Run your coax from the adapter to your HD Box
that should be with you in the attic. Work on
moving just 1 antenna at a time mark on the post
with a pencil, which stations come in best at
that particular position. Try to bring in the
most stations you can with the one antenna, then
try to catch the stragglers with the second antenna.
Sometimes it takes a while to get a good combination
between the two before you get what you want.
When you get to a point where you have all the
stations your going to get, I recommend running
a solid core copper RG-6 cable directly from the
adapter to the location where your box will reside.
The longer the run, the more it will reduce your
signal. So try to make the run short as possible.
Tip!
I have done a couple of installs where I got great
results, by catching the signals that were bouncing
off another building across the street.
Note on amplifiers!
Try not to use them unless you have to. Some times
they do miracles and sometimes, they just amplify
your problems.
Good luck!
sadfdddddaDSAF
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| Post 20 made on Saturday March 13, 2004 at 16:00 |
Homeboy Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | February 2004
216 |
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In San Diego, I can receive SD & LA (depending on the direction I move it) and depending on the atmosephere. Is it possible to have one 4228 pointed South & one pointed North? I would love to get both at the same time as apposed to one.
HB
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| Post 21 made on Sunday March 21, 2004 at 19:38 |
HDTVJunkie Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | March 2004
467 |
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Is it possible to have one 4228 pointed South & one pointed North?
I would think your output would be very strange on the channels that San Diego and Los Angeles both use. With a second receiver, you could use a second TV input without trouble.
You could, at some expense, build your own head-end unit to modulate all the channels from both markets on the channel numbers of your choice.
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| Post 22 made on Monday March 22, 2004 at 01:22 |
RTI Installer Super Member |
Joined:
Posts: | March 2002
3,320 |
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On 03/12/04 20:12, biz56 said...
RTI Installer: Have you ever tried stacking two CM4228s and pointing them in the same direction? (rather than in a "V" as discussed above)? Would this increase the gain of a digital UHF signal significantly? I'm 50 miles from the transmitter and the CM7775 preamp I tried with my single CM4228 in the attic did not help. The antenna is correctly aimed at the transmitter per the signal meter in my STB. If you think stacking might help, would the procedure to connect the two antennas be the same as you gave above? Thanks. | First go to this address [Link: antennaweb.org]
sadfdddddaDSAF Sure I have, I have even put up multiple 4228's in different parts of on attic to catch reflections off of other buildings, kind of a pain in the ass and a gamble with your time versus getting paid if it does not work. The more antennas you put up the more gain, but there is also an increase in unwanted interference, grounding is critical. If your intention is to feed more than one set top box from the same antenna array, you will also need to use a distribution amplifier with adequate bandwidth to farm out your signal.
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Never Ignore the Obvious -- H. David Gray |
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| Post 23 made on Wednesday November 10, 2004 at 23:15 |
Sxrxrnr Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | December 2003
100 |
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Do not have room to stack antennas in attic. However do have remote controlled Channel Master Rotator(controlled by MX 500). Works well, but sometimes I still get searching for digital signal. Have tried both of Channel Masters largest UHF antennas(bow and yagi). Both perform about the same. Still using Comcast HD receiver for local HD when antenna is flaky and using Directv sat for everything else. Still no local Fox support from Comcast for HD.
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| Post 24 made on Thursday November 11, 2004 at 00:05 |
bcf1963 Super Member |
Joined:
Posts: | September 2004
2,767 |
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I chose the largest high gain antenna know for multipath rejection that would fit in my attic. I bought it with the intention that if I didn't get good signal, I'd have it mounted on my roof, on a mast.
Yes... I signed the Home Owners Association restrictions when I bought the home, less than 6 months ago. Yes... they included an illegal restriction on exterior TV antennas. I looked into this, and if you fit the legal requirements, (basically you own the location where the antenna is mounted, or the location is your personal space... like a balcony) it is up to the HOA or other authority to get a waiver from the government before they can force you to take the antenna down. (Unless they have evidence of a safety danger. Example: Mast close to power line.) Even if you must take the antenna down, you cannot be fined or charged for putting the antenna up. The law clearly states all the above points.
After attic mounting, I was amazed! I'm getting solid 80's to 85's for signal strength well north of Dallas, for every Dallas station broadcasting. I have no reason to move the antenna, it's giving me great reception. If the antenna is damaged by weather conditions, I've got bigger problems than reception, as my whole roof must have blown off.
I have had my HD antenna in my attic for about 3 months now. I'm getting solid signals at all times, including really heavy rain. (My DirecTV cuts out, but the antenna keeps going.)
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| Post 25 made on Tuesday November 16, 2004 at 21:52 |
Ernie Bornn-Gilman Yes, That Ernie! |
Joined:
Posts: | December 2001
30,104 |
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On 03/22/04 00:38 ET, HDTVJunkie said...
Is it possible to have one 4228 pointed South
& one pointed North?
I would think your output would be very strange
on the channels that San Diego and Los Angeles
both use. With a second receiver, you could use
a second TV input without trouble. According to antennaweb.org, three channels compete: 25 is an indie in Van Nuys, and shows up almost completely snowed in at my house five miles away, but it also ABC Digital in San Diego; 39 is Digital of Mexican CH 52, and NBC in San Diego; 51 is Digital Korean in Palos Verdes and an indie in San Diego. So...how badly do weak analog signals affect digitals on the same frequency? I can't see how NBC or ABC would have channels that could be interfered with in areas between markets. You could, at some expense, build your own head-end
unit to modulate all the channels from both markets
on the channel numbers of your choice. WOW! What a concept! You really must capitalize SOME when you write "SOME expense!" To make this worthwhile, you would need several antennas, a tuner for each station, and a combination of analog and HD modulators in this head-end. It would already cost thousands if you just stuck with analog stations!
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A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw |
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| Post 26 made on Wednesday November 17, 2004 at 16:10 |
barlow Active Member |
Joined:
Posts: | September 2004
535 |
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RTI Installer
Could you elaborate on this:
"Cable HD is only a shadow of local HD and will never be as good a picture, but ya gota do what ya gota do"
Are you saying that if you compared cable HD coming into your house to OTA HD that the OTA HD picture will be a better picture ?
I guess I nievely thought they would be the same quality.
-Don B
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| Post 27 made on Thursday November 18, 2004 at 01:51 |
Daniel Tonks Wrangler of Remotes |
Joined:
Posts: | October 1998
28,780 |
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I did such a comparison and found off-air to be noticably sharper - from 20 feet away!
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| Post 28 made on Friday November 19, 2004 at 11:46 |
DBrown Founding Member |
Joined:
Posts: | February 2002
1,049 |
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I find the cable VS OTA HDTV quality comparison very interesting. One would think that if the originating source (say CBS-HDTV) was the same, and no one inbetween you and that source is downsampling the upsampling the signal, then digital should be digital should be digital, and both sources should look the same.
But we know there is some compression involved, and that SAT or CABLE sources might be re-compressing the original signal in order to cram it down their "pipe" to you. So is the difference one sees between on CABLE HDTV similar to lossy compression flaws (like crappy WMV or MPEGs that can be found on the web), or is it more like week and strong analog stations?
That brings up another issue... Are there any STANDARDS for HDTV that include how much it can be compressed, or is the only standard the resolution?
Just curious.
DBrown
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| Post 29 made on Tuesday December 28, 2004 at 21:52 |
Sxrxrnr Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | December 2003
100 |
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I just installed a HI Def Tivo for my Directv system. Works quite well, but I am now back to requiring my attic antenna for Hi Def as Comcast Cable(which I also have for network Hi Def programming) will not feed my Tivo. Directv is now offering ABC, CBS and NBC(though I have not yet received approval for this network channel). Supposedly they will be offering Fox and PBS one day. When this occurs I will be able to cut the cord with both my antenna and Comcast. What is too bad for me is that ABC and CBS which Directv offers, are my best OTA channels. NBC is good when I use rotator. PBS and Fox are my least reliable OTA. Comcast does not offer Fox in my area for HD. All confusing I know. But I do love Hi Def Tivo. For quite sometime I have had a Sony HD 100 Hi Def receiver, but found that most of my TV watching was in SD as convenience of Tivo outweighed superior picture of HD. Will be soon upgrading hard drives to support additional video storage. Currently only offers 30 hours of HD, but about 200 hours of SD. I have upgraded my other Tivo's with larger drives so they get close to 200 hours of SD and this has worked well for several years. Mx 500(had a few technical issue/problems with MX 500 that I had to work thru--still have one "dead" device port/button) is running 3 Tivo's, Parasound C1, DVD, Mitz DLP, Rotator, and VCR perfectly. Even my wife can run it after some schooling. Found a method to use Mx 500 to go directly to required Mitz input, so able to set up macros to do so.
Roger
Silicon Valley, Ca
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| Post 30 made on Wednesday January 19, 2005 at 14:52 |
jaak Lurking Member |
Joined:
Posts: | October 2004
4 |
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On 03/21/04 19:38 ET, HDTVJunkie said...
Is it possible to have one 4228 pointed South
& one pointed North? If they truly are opposite directions e.g. north and south, not northeast and southeast, you could try removing the reflector (the grid mesh behind the bowties) from the 4228 to make it bidirectional. You would lose some gain (minimal) but it would become directional both ways and null only off the sides.
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